Sunday, February 03, 2008

Anime World Order Show # 65 - Gurren-Lagann, Sojitz, and a .50 Cal Rampage

The heavens have been broken through and the US anime industry has been drilled yet again as we officially hit the magic number for syndication! In the news, we're talking about this ADV brouhaha and Clarissa's reviewing Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann.

Click Here to Download

February 2008 on the Greatest Movie EVER! podcast is Hunt You Like An Animal: The Most Dangerous Month. Various special guest podcasters have chimed in for these festivities, including Daryl, so be sure to check it out. Don't worry, they won't take as long to listen to as this episode will.

Introduction (0:00 - 24:50)
We're kind of behind on these emails. Nevertheless, Daryl sees fit to read one we got several months back regarding a then-newly created Youtube video. Perhaps you saw it. And the response. And the other response. Then we talk about the dwindling Orlando anime scene and brainstorm regarding what our largest anime purchases were. See if YOU can spot the parts of this segment that normally would have been edited out, but this time we forgot.

Let's News! (24:50 - 1:09:39)
Daryl's recording was entirely too loud during this and Clarissa's was entirely too soft, but Gerald's recording was JUST RIGHT. There's really only one topic discussed during all this, but in true AWO fashion, it's every topic: the bizarre scenario regarding the removal from the ADV Films website of most of their newer licenses. Us fans on the ground still don't know much about what's happening save for this statement that was released, so all we can do is kick the anime punditry into high gear. Unlike real journalists, pundits don't NEED facts. Actually, there aren't very many real journalists left anymore, come to think of it.

Promo: R5 Central (1:09:39 - 1:10:43)
That crazy cat Mike Dent doesn't want to admit it in public, but he just barely cheated death in the past month and change since the last episode of his show. As such, he's currently gearing up for the 50th episode of the show. Truly a podcasting milestone! We'd record a congratulatory message to be played at the time, but we keep forgetting.

Review: Tengen Toppa Gurren-Lagann (1:10:43 - 1:51:46)
Clarissa spirals away with one of the most requested titles people have asked us to review in some time. Witness Gainax's return to form as we notice that evolution is a mystery, full of change that no one sees. The YJ Stinger can contains a swarm of bees. HnK thugs say it as they please: "hidebu and abeshi." As they explode out of their spleen, EVOLUTION. EVOLUTION!

The Sonic Soldier Borgman review and the NYAF recap are still to come, but anyone who's thinking they should rush to post a comment immediately before downloading and listening to the show catches a 138 millimeter round through the dome.


79 comments:

Jaime said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Daryl Surat said...

*BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM*

These comments have been placed under RAMBO'S LAW, which as the post clearly states demands that one listen to the show first, leave comments later!

Further Rambo laws will be revealed as they are made up.

Dan said...

I doubt DMC will be delayed, because that's easy money. Wallflower will depend on current sales. It's the Cromartie High manga which has me concerned, since that's almost done, and I'm already waiting for Tokyopop to continue Lupin again...

John said...

Maybe it WAS the jackets!

Craig said...

Color me impressed, internet. You were able to review Gurren Lagann and only mention the three main chracters and only one secondry chracter.

I was awaiting the Nia moe slant talk.

Also, ADV? I HAVE NO ADV! Stupid £20 (40$) Releases and then they ask why no one buys thier shit.

Ah well, wouln't be the first time I've been denied hot blood in favor of the dreaded spectres.

...

VOLTRON IS AN ANTI SPIRAL! DO NOT GO INTO THE WORLD OF NON EVOLUTION! AYU IS A ANTI SPIRAL AND USES CUTE TO GET TO YOU!!!

FIGHT THE POWER

FIGHT THE-

Jerane said...

Gerald, don't give up on your resolution to kill a man, just update it to include wearing his skin

VZ said...

Funny, most of the reasons why GL is popular are why I haven't wanted to watch it past the first ep. I have a feeling that the show will be put on CN (providing that whole Sojitz thing works out). I'm not a fan of that graffiti/hip hop-ish art style used in GL, Diebuster, FLCL or Dead Leaves.

So Clarissa, are you going to review Lucky Star in the future?

I was actually looking forward to Borgman and NYAF review more than the GL one.

Dan said...

vz: Dead Leaves was meant to have a more retro style, but its "story" totally blew. Dunno wtf was up with Diebuster, though. It's like the anime equivalent of Scrappy Doo to me...

Anonymous said...

Personally, I'm more excited for Son of Rambow.

Gooberzilla said...

Anyone who expresses excitement for Son of Rambow or any other charming foreign comedy involving heart-warming tales of children and their friendships should be driven from their home by mohawked Hokuto no Ken thugs and beaten through the streets of their community with flaming bamboo rods. >:-(

Alexander Strange said...

A lot of Gainax's bad fanservice shows were coproduction with SHAFT; they both do pretty well on their own.

(although they did make Diebuster and Moon Phase respectively, so…)

Clarissa said...

Color me impressed, internet. You were able to review Gurren Lagann and only mention the three main chracters and only one secondry chracter.

The podcast reviews kind of force things like that. Personally I could have, and would have liked to, talk more about some supporting characters (Rossiu~) and such but then it 1) gets way too long and sucks for review purposes and 2) it usually ends up involving heavy spoilers, so...

Also, oddly enough Nia doesn't bother me. I'm not sure why, maybe her personality/behavior just make more sense given her particular back story.

Clarissa said...

Agh, stupid no comment editing.

Re: Lucky Star, I'm not sure if I'll do it or Gerald will. I think I might do Potemayo first.

Gerald said...

I was actually looking forward to Borgman and NYAF review more than the GL one.

Man, the amount of emails and people contacting me in anticipation of the Borgman review really make me wish I could go back and do a better job. SOMEONE FIND ME THIS ENTIRE SHOW TO WATCH! Damn ADV releasing episodes out of no where.

Brack said...

What makes GL more appealing than other robot shows?

Kazuki Nakashima.

He's got a stated intention to make escapist entertainment for the masses, whereas a lot of other writers in anime nowadays are writing for a preconceived niche audience.

His other show from 07, Oh! Edo Rocket (an adaptation of his play), even manages to get some decent visual creativity from less talented folk than were on GL (certainly it's the best thing Seiji Mizushima has done).

Dan said...

Who cares about Son of Ranbow when you got Rainbo? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=md9EoHycUrA

VZ said...

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Sonic+Soldier+Borgman&search_type=&search=Search

Youtube has a bunch of the Borgman episodes subbed, which tells me these are either from fansubs or the HK bootleg.

I think Anice Farm is one of the most beautiful anime girls ever IMO.

I got to wonder if the only reason the two OVA's came was some ADV deal of "license this show only if you take this show" or maybe ADV wanted to release the series too but backed out.

Because really, it's hard to get what the characters were about from just those short films.

Hope to hear Part 2 of this ep in a few days. Please don't take forever with this one.

VZ said...

>Re: Lucky Star, I'm not sure if I'll do it or Gerald will. I think I might do Potemayo first.<

Nice! I've seen a couple of episode of Potemayo. Highly enjoyable.

I still want Daryl to review Moetan and Kodomo no Jikan. It has to be Daryl, no one else will do.

Speaking of it, you guys brought up an interesting argument about Japan mostly making shows that appeal to a limited niche audience. Those two shows above are even less so because there's no possible way a U.S. licenser would even think to brings those out.

Mind you, I don't want Japan to start making things they think America wants to see, that's how we end up with Afro Samurai and Karas. Karas is so boring I could never watch it straight though even though Stars Encore plays it all the time.

Think about this. What were seeing now is almost like how the 80's were. Alot of the 80's, early 90's OVA's were targeted towards anime otaku anyway. It's kind of the same thing today with alot of short 12-13 ep shows designed only for anime otaku.

Dan said...

vz: Except that the writers at least tried to do something with the 80s stuff, and now it all looks uniform.

TJ said...

Yay, Rambo's Law!

Anyway, you guys brought up some very interesting points about the ADV situation, as well as the whole anime industry in general. Ideally, some industry people will actually listen to this episode and try to make some good changes to the industry, but that's probably just wishful thinking.

I know this is going to sound like a stupid question, but did ADV actually lose the licenses to all those shows? From how that news story was worded, it didn't seem to me like they actually lost the licenses. Plus, a lot of those shows (like Gurren Lagann) are still available for pre-order on websites like Rightstuf. So, I don't know what's going on over there at ADV.

Clarissa: Nice Gurren Lagann review. Admittedly, I never finished the show, since ADV licensed it about halfway through, but I may have to download the rest of it, because it sounds amazing. And I'm kind of surprised that none of you (especially Daryl) didn't hate on Nia at all. I hated Nia!!

One more random comment before I get out of here: Why would anyone spend $600 on the 5 Star Stories laserdisk!? Sure, it's super rare, but come on, it really isn't THAT good of a movie. I would spend that on the Daicon 4 laserdisk (if i was filthy rich), but 5 Star Stories!? Damn.

wildarmsheero said...

Whoa, whoa, whoa, are you guys talking about me at around the 42 minute mark? I love Kodomo no Jikan, manga and anime, but the original Gundam Trilogy is one of my absolute favourites. And yes, I did also watch Space Battleship Yamato (series 1 and 2, plus movies. Haven't seen the third series series.)

To surprise you even more, I own the first 2 volumes of Air, and the first three volumes of Black Lagoon. And to top it all off I massive figure and hug pillow collection. :V

wildarmsheero said...

And to top it all off I massive figure and hug pillow collection. :V<-- er, through a "have" in there.

Also, are you guys ever going to review Baccano? It's something you'd all probably like.

quartears said...

Gurren Lagann is uber manly.

Tim Eldred said...

Borgman. One of the few shows I watched and then ERASED. It just seemed to me like a Zillion knockoff, which is saying something since Zillion was a knockoff of many other things. But anyway.

I've never had a problem finding manga volumes because I get all of them from one very simple and easy source: Diamond. If you visit a comic book store regularly, odds are they make the Diamond catalog ("Previews") available to customers. I've been picking up this thing for years and ordering all my stuff through it. It's really the only way to guarantee getting what you want since comic stores don't (as a rule) choose to stock everything that's available.

Once you get into the habit, it's easy. You might even get yourself a discount, depending on the store you go to. Give it a try!

Steve Harrison said...

Tim, the problem with the comic store/Diamond approach is you then become slave to the 'Diamond Lottery', where if there's ANY hiccup you might never know what happened- was the title cancelled by the publisher? Did the store actually order it? Was it published but Diamond didn't get enough orders to meet their desired profit goals so they cancelled all their orders regardless?

Plus comic shops don't give that catalog away anymore, they're reluctant to order unless you're a regular or have committed to a 'pull box' with some goal of (x) amount of product ordered and PICKED UP every month, blah blah blah.

No, of course stores can't carry every title be it anime or manga, nobody has that much 'open-to-buy' free to tie up in inventory for 'might happen someday' sales (altho it sure doesn't stop some shops from speculating on junk like 'rare' figures and mini busts and the like), that's why Clarissa's comment on going to one of the Major Book Stores and using their special order resources to get those titles that aren't getting decent distro is the right thing.

I'm feeling a rant about the entire pricing structure of the US anime and manga world boiling up...

tim Eldred said...

Everything else aside, in my experience buying manga through Diamond, I have never missed a volume. That's all I'm saying.

VZ said...

Hey Daryl, did you buy the three volumes of Machine Robo yet?

Ah yes, Viking + Kung Fu = Vikunfu and also Devil Satan 6.

Although it's usually written as Baikanfu.

I can't wait to hear what you say about the lame attempt at a maid cafe that was at NYAF.

Gilles Poitras said...

Two factors on companies having trouble.

1. Fansubs, if people are spending their time watching fansubs do they have time to watch stuff they buy?

2. The dollar being below the toilet. With the exchange rate at 106 yen to the dollar there is just less cash to license titles with.

Brack said...

The main problem the anime DVD market has is that it doesn't seem to understand the DVD market as a whole. Certain sections still seem to be operating with a VHS head on their shoulders.

For example, this week you have Glass Fleet Vol.3 with a RRP of $29.99, the price of a feature film release (for instance 3:10 to Yuma has a RRP of $29.95).

Now, that seems a ludicrous price to ask for four episodes of TV-level animation that have not been aired on US television. It's essentially a DTV release, at a feature film price, with television quality.

Is there any other section of the DVD market that makes its consumers gamble like that, or gouges them for that much money for TV material? Even Paramount aren't that bad.

Whatever the reasons* this ludicrous releasing/pricing exists, the result is that the majority of anime releases just frankly don't deserve to thrive in the DVD market as a whole. I know the bulk of my DVD purchases over the last three years have gone to US and UK TV boxsets over anime releases, on a purely value for money basis.

* The main reason seems to be the Japanese anime industry. There's often the argument made that DVDs are more expensive there, but looking at amazon.jp, anime DVDs are more expensive still. Is there any excuse for the extortionate prices on 60s, 70s and 80s shows that surely must have made back their money decades ago?

ScottGreen said...

regarding Gilles Poitras' point...
It's pretty clear that illegal, digital distribution is pretty indefensible at this point. That it has hurt sales of specific titles and the chance that specific titles will be released in North America.

But, I'm not certain that you can prove that is actually damaging the industry. If you waved a magic wand and tomorrow no one was was able to download anime, would significantly more people buy more anime, or, would they simply find something else to do? Maybe, there are many people downloading anime for whom, it isn't just that a $30 DVD or a DMC protected digitally distributed copy can't complete with a free download, but that those people simply will not buy anime.

Gilles Poitras said...

I always view anime as an import product where the distributor has to pay a percentage back to the original company. For example import titles like The Prisoner or The Avengers retail for comparable prices to many anime.

On the other hand for prices to drop sales will have to go up. After all we are no longer paying $40.00 - $75.00 for imported shows as we were in the late 80s and early 90s. That price drop was possible due to volume making up the difference.

In any case I agree prices need to drop, perhaps if more companies do box sets first as AnimEigo has been doing they may.

Brack said...

The Prisoner and Avengers releases in the UK have long been overpriced, so it's not that good a comparison. I think at the current dollar levels, it'd be cheaper for me to import The Prisoner from the US than buy it here in the UK. If you were to look at the prices of Cosgrove-Hall animation released in the US, then it's offering value for money comparable to US animated productions of the same era, and certainly better value than anime (you can get three times as much Dangermouse for the same price as a typical anime release).

At one point anime was an import product, but now, with some shows budgets seemingly reliant on international sales, it's an export product.

And if you are planning on selling something in a foreign market, it might help to understand how that market works.

And part of the problem may be that some of the US anime companies are now dinosaurs of a bygone age of when anime was an import product. They need to buy less, buy smarter, market better and package/price it in a way to make it more appealing to casual DVD purchaser.

Dan said...

brack: "Is there any excuse for the extortionate prices on 60s, 70s and 80s shows that surely must have made back their money decades ago?"

Production costs for other shows, possible small fanbase for the home releases, etc.

gilles: The Avengers and The Prisoner cost more, because A&E is greedy. HBO charges more for hit shows released here, too. So I don't buy that import theory, especially since you can get most BBC titles at legit prices.

Anyway, the problem is on the Japan side. With the exception of the occasional Haruhi or One Piece, no one gives a fuck about what's being made over there anymore.

quartears said...

Before listening to you guys and actually buying anime instead of downloading I was like most teenagers not placing any value on buying the DVD. After listening to you guys and getting DVDs I finally felt the power of the extra value. It feels weird to download shows now.


Also, why did they take down Toonami after school? I remember being pissed off when they took it down. I miss the days when I could watch anime after school. I would definitely watch anime on tv after school if they had it on. Even if it is just reruns of Zoids or whatnot. It would be totally awesome if Golgo 13 or Fist of the North Star was on.

Behonkiss said...

I think that if ADV was really losing all those shows, they would announce it immediately, because something like that would sink them.

Also, I gave GL the three-episode test when it came out and was indifferent to it, and when I heard about Nia and the shift in main characters I was even less interested, but the art style and concept still sound great. Does it drastically improve as it goes on?

ScottGreen said...

"Also, why did they take down Toonami after school? "

It's my understanding that the ratings were fine, but the demographics skewed too old. They wanted to be able to attract a younger crowd in those time slots.

VZ said...

>Fist of the North Star was on.

I saw some of FOTNS when it was shown on Encore Action. I didn't care for it but now I realize that was due to the Manga Ent. hack job and those early filler episodes.

I know alot of people tend to hard on the Japanese pricing scheme and I'm not going to defend it but for a show like Moetan let's say, only a small niche upon a niche audience would even buy that. And apparently Lucky Star sells really well on DVD over there at $50 for 2 eps. Compare otaku related anime to children's anime (and I don't mean old show rereleased on DVD), and you'll see that they're actually priced normally like Onegai My Melody (the show done by Sanrio). So it's really a case of charging that much because they know there's people that would pay for it.

Pixy Misa said...

Clarissa: Re: Lucky Star, I'm not sure if I'll do it or Gerald will. I think I might do Potemayo first.

Woo! Potemayo!

VZ: I still want Daryl to review Moetan and Kodomo no Jikan. It has to be Daryl, no one else will do.

I'd pay money to hear that. Maybe we can take up a collection?

Dan said...

I imagine Daryl reviewing that shit would involve him being strapped to a chair, Clockwork Orange-style.

Craig said...

Also, oddly enough Nia doesn't bother me. I'm not sure why, maybe her personality/behavior just make more sense given her particular back story.

Fair enough, I was sure someone would note it given how much she has the whole + eye thing that Nono did in Daibuster.

And all I'll say on Rossiu is that he looks like Fai from Xenogears and more or less copy's his progression minus geting the hot reincarnation of his world's Eve.

And, seriously? Potemayo? Now, that's something I'd LOVE to see happen if only for the funny.

Gilles Poitras said...

For the heck of it looking up rambo in one of my Japanese English dictionaries it gives the definition of:

rough; outragious; lawless; unreasonable; reckless

dxint said...

Maybe it's because I haven't watched any Gainax stuff (except for FLCL, which I didn't like at all) before, but I thought Gurren-Lagann was hugely inspired by GaoGaiGar. I don't say that to discredit GL, but to try and get the dialogue about the show to go beyond the fact that it is Gainax and related to Gainax-like conventions.

*GL spoilers*

The story line of GL grows and develops in the same way that GGG does. GL begins as a terrestrial show, with a boss who has 4 main henchmen. After defeating the four henchmen, the heroes defeat the boss, who alerts them to an even larger space paradigm which threatens them. The heroes take to space, and the plot gets huge and epic, much in the same way that GGG Final did. However, I think (as much as I love the resurgence of Getter stuff and the GaoGaiGar anime) GL also gets epic very effectively and "logically". I remember wondering WTF was going on at the very end of Shin Getter Robo Armageddon, for example. Not so much with New Getter Robo (because it is badass to spend eternity in a large robot in space killing gods). I think GL succeeds as a story.

*end spoilers*

In my case, the fanservice in GL was so offputting that there was a month-long gap between me watching the first three episodes and the rest of the series. After I came back to the show, however, I ended up watching the entire series in one night (at 2x normal speed, mind you, but the entire series all the same).

Love the show,
Peace,
dxInt

Clarissa said...

Also, I gave GL the three-episode test when it came out and was indifferent to it, and when I heard about Nia and the shift in main characters I was even less interested, but the art style and concept still sound great. Does it drastically improve as it goes on?

I'd say it definitely does. GL is one of those shows that the three-episode test is kind of questionable on. Not that the beginning of the show is bad, but it's stylish and fun whereas the later portions are stylish, fun, smart and moving. It just gets progressively more epic.

As to shift in characters, I'd have to say not really. Sure there's a major death and Nia's introduction, but honestly Simon was always the main character--Kamina just grabbed attention by being charming and very loud. :D

(And if you like Kamina, you may be very happy with certain developments later on. I'll refrain from saying more for spoilers.)

Rossiu does grab attention later on, which makes me happy (though others may disagree) but I feel like it was necessary for the characters and some of what the show wanted to say. Though it's not like Simon goes away for that space of time.

I enjoyed GL when it first started, but by the end I unexpectedly fell in love. So I'd say give it another shot, preferably at least to a bit after the timeskip.

dxint,

I do see the parallels between GL and Gaogaigar, even though I didn't mention it. GGG definitely operates on that epic scale seen in shows like Gunbuster or Shin Getter Robo.

It's interesting that you mention fanservice. I was bothered by it initially in GL, though I felt like between the over-the-top nature of the show and the equal-opportunity fanservice I didn't really notice it by the end.

Inappropriate fanservice did, however, make me completely unable to watch all of GGG Final. Seriously, where did that come from? And it was terrible, unsexy (IMO) fanservice too. Ugh.

tim Eldred said...

Beh. Grumble. You kids.

In MY day we had a FIVE-episode test! Ding-blasted short-attention-span-havin' backwards-cap-wearin' download-savvy whippersnappers!

Baaaaaaah! Gettoffa my lawn!

Steve Harrison said...

Clarissa, if you want the whole story on what Daryl alluded to with some of his comments about how there's no market to place an anime series on TV, he cribbed (kinda sorta, I'm sure he didn't mean to) from my blog:

http://tochiro998.livejournal.com/1552.html

I think I do a reasonable job of explaining why the things so many people want to happen just WON'T happen now. It's too late, the infrastructure is gone, all gone.

One thing I didn't add was a discussion of 4Kids, their 'leasing' of the Sat. Fox kidvid block, and how their contract is up either this year or 2009, and there is serious question if Fox will renew their relationship with 4Kids.

Bah.

Deadend said...

Gurren Lagann was probably the best anime I have seen in.. well, I can't go by years since I don't watch that much. Lets go with 15 or so series.

It is the pinnacle of shows involving robots being piloted. Really, the genre should stop now, because Gurren Lagann will be too hard to beat.

It had Simon, who is a more likable whiny bitch in the Shinji vein, and it had Kamiya who is your standard awesome giant robot hero. From the start it bridged the cliches. It had no filler, the status quo never lasted more than 3-4 episodes. There was such a sense of... movement and progress to it.

The only thing I can pick at is how if there are 1,000,000 people, it sure looks like there are more. As that is a huge city... and it seems it's not the only city out there. But whatever.

The characters evolve and changed over the course of the series and NONE of the characters were truly evil, not even the villain, the logic behind their actions is understandable. It's amazing when a show can have sides so opposed, but you can look at any character and go "oh, I totally get where you are coming from."

It also had some damn awesome fights, a great sense of scale and wonder, some tragedy, humor, drama, loads of action and bouncy boobs. Honestly, what can top it?

Dan said...

tim: I remember when people were telling me to wait through 12 eps before trashing Macross 7.

steve: So you don't think the Speed Racer and DBZ movies will give the industry a shot in the arm?

Carl: Oh yeah. I was also thinking that re-releasing Legend of Mother Sarah makes sense in light of that new Sarah Connor tv show.

Gerald said...

It is the pinnacle of shows involving robots being piloted. Really, the genre should stop now, because Gurren Lagann will be too hard to beat.

It's comments like that (serious or not), that force me to chime in with my opinion. I really didn't go in to it since I'm sort of mixed on the show.

Maybe it's because of the number of giant robot shows I've seen, but Gurren Lagann seemed like a good show to me, not great, not awesome, not amazing, just a good solid show with some interesting (if not personally appealing) design sense. Perhaps because so many people were going on and on with me about how they'd never seen anything like the show before and it's so original. I guess since I've seen virtually every element in the show before in other shows it didn't blow me away with it's originality and since I was never a big fan of the design of Dead Leaves, Gurren Lagann never really grabbed me either.

Again, it's not that I didn't like the show, but I guess I'm sort of out there against the grain in that it's just a "OK" show for me.

In the review Daryl kept going on about why one show is really popular or really well liked while another show with similar elements is not and something I've had to think about since there's a lot of shows I like and dislike that are very similar. All I can say is that one show has elements that come together and click with me while another show doesn't. It doesn't always make sense and I can't and won't make a template for my tastes. Whatever it is, Gurren will most likely sit with me as a solidly above average show, but I guess because so much of the show reminded me of Gunbuster so much so, especially towards the end, that Gunbuster still sits as my favorite.

I did like the Rossiu character (mainly towards the end) since he embodies the type of person that I think everyone has had to be at one point. The person that is forced to make incredibly unpopular decisions not because they want to, but because they know it's for the best or it's right and they're aware of how much people will hate them for it afterwards.

(And on a different subject)
"Also, why did they take down Toonami after school? "

It's my understanding that the ratings were fine, but the demographics skewed too old. They wanted to be able to attract a younger crowd in those time slots.


This really annoys me. While I understand that they want a particular audience, I don't understand why they can't be happy with the audience that they get and, perhaps nurture that audience, such as what happened with Gaogaigar which was supposed to be a kids show before they realized no kids were watching it and main audience were hard core otaku. So they started appealing to that audience and it ended up being the most popular Brave show made. Didn't some show like Justice League suffer a similar fate in the US of not appealing to the right audience so it got canceled? I don't remember. You'd think that some of those companies would love an older audience, an audience that's got more money to spend, here come the deluxe $45 action figures!

tim Eldred said...

Various thinkings on things:

About 4Kids. They can probably shine on their relationship with Fox since they just bought up the Sat AM block that was once owned by Kids WB. They're currently prepping a new season of TMNT to go there, plus a Yugi-Oh knockoff called 'Chaotic,' and probably a few other things that cost less than a full-on domestic production. Fortunately, WB still has stuff going on but it's a pale echo of what it used to be before they sold off their own programming block. Someone must have cleared a huge bonus for that, but it makes no sense to me.

About the "aging up" of a particular show, like Justice League: it's very difficult to do that on the fly after ad contracts have been signed and an entire programming block has been tailored to a specific demographic. If the ad time has been pre-sold on the basis of certain age groups tuning into a block, all the components of that block have to satisfy the same criteria. Also, because of production lead time, no one has any ratings to respond to until an entire season has been written...so the only time you can change the formula is at the start of a new season. And if that requires you to change advertisers, it's probably frowned upon.

About the mania surrounding GL: not having seen it yet, I can't comment on the show itself ( I will definitely seek it out after hearing Clarissa's fab review) but having seen this trend over and over, I can comment on trend itself. Every few years something like this pops up that grabs the newbies and blows their minds because they haven't seen anything like it before, and that's cool. But when you've been watching these things for a while and your context widens, it gets easier to identify the roots. The thing is, when those roots go 30 years deep, they can't help but be pretty gnarly. You can pull up all the roots you want and wave them in the faces of the GL maniacs, and the basic reaction is always going to be, yuck, get that gnarly shit outta my face!

You get the same thing when you point at any recent fighting show and trace the roots back to Hokuto no Ken; it belongs to an earlier time and it just looks gnarly. No way around it. No matter when you tune into this art form, most of the stuff from earlier years will look dated and primitive and the newbies either reject it or learn to like it. It all depends on the newbie.

But take comfort; Today's GL maniacs will go through the same thing ten years from now when some new state-of-the-art mecha show pops up and a whole new generation of newbies will gush all over it and the "old school" GL fans will lambaste them for not recognizing the roots that go back to GL.

This cycle is part and parcel of the medium. I generally find that those who are willing to learn the context naturally gravitate backward down the roots to see where it all came from. Historically, such people are in the minority, but that's just fine by me. I'm happy to be among them.

Anonymous said...

re: GGG / GL parallels

Plus, on the VA side Viral = Guy Shishioh

dxInt said...

Thanks anonymous, I forgot to mention that in the post, but I thought the same thing. There are oodles of similarities.

Steve Harrison said...

Tim, you're right about 4Kids taking over the KidsWB programming chores (of course you're right, you've likely got some of the trade mags discussing this if nothing else :) ) but it's a bad move for 4Kids. They're moving to an even more marginalized market, reducing the eyeballs by a significant number compared to the wide syndi of the Fox Sat KidVid block.

And since Warner Bros does have that 'in house generated product foremost' mandate going on, it could very well be they're subletting KidsWB just to burn off station contractual obligations prior to shutting it down or rebranding it.

I do wonder what Fox is going to do. They're not going to want to give up that Sat. block to local stations. I wonder if they're going to start in-house program creation again and flood it with 'reality' programming geared to 'tweens and teens.

Dan said...

When exactly did the Japanese become as stupid as Americans? http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2008-02-07/bandais-bubble-wrap-popping-keychain-now-with-moe

tim Eldred said...

I have no idea what Fox is planning to do with Sat AM, but I can say that I'm directly affected by the KidsWB > 4Kids transition since the WB show I worked on last year has not been renewed. Instead, I'll be working on the new Batman series for fall '08. As far as I can tell, this is now the ONLY show being produced at WB. This is down from about a half-dozen shows they had in production when I started there in '03. It's depressing to see what this one-time powerhouse has been reduced to. The fact that they gave up their own block is what mystifies me.

ScottGreen said...

Off topic, but potentially of interest, have you guys heard of "In Bruges?" From what I've read, it sounds like the high culture name checking answer to Crank Shoot 'em Up, ect.

quartears said...

finally listened to the entire thing.


Daryl, I saw Rambo. It was too fucking awesome. Especially when he puts that claymore next to the undetonated missile. When he killed those child killers and rapists it was cool.

Did you see that commerical before the movie? Son of RamboW. I had to watch Rambo to bring me from the dark edges of being an emo. I will be sure to never get that close again after losing in a speech tournament.

Dan said...

tim: I'm actually surprised they didn't axe that network sooner. I stopped caring about them after that POS Histeria...

exedore said...

"have you guys heard of "In Bruges?" From what I've read, it sounds like the high culture name checking answer to Crank Shoot 'em Up, ect."

It's running/ran at Sundance, and I'm eagerly awaiting the UK release. If you want to see what the author/director's work is like, you can get a DVD of 2005 Academy Award nominee shorts - his is "Six-Shooter" (also available on iTunes). Or, if you're really hardcore, you can find a production of "The Lieutenant of Inishmore" and/or "The Pillowman" near you as an example of Mr. McDonagh's theatrical endeavours.

ogiuemaniax said...

"Is there any excuse for the extortionate prices on 60s, 70s and 80s shows that surely must have made back their money decades ago?"

Actually, significantly older shows are much cheaper overall even among Region 2 Anime DVDs.

Getting all of Genshiken 2 will cost you roughly $300, and that's for only 12 episodes.

All of the Cardcaptor Sakura TV series will cost you about $700 for 70 episodes.

THE ENTIRE Hokuto no Ken, all 190-something episodes including Hokuto no Ken 2 will cost you approximately $1000. Still a huge cost, but much cheaper than Genshiken 2 and CCS on a per episode basis.

Brack said...

"Actually, significantly older shows are much cheaper overall even among Region 2 Anime DVDs."

Oh I knew that, but it is still ridiculously extortionate. Just because it's not as ridiculously expensive as it could be, doesn't mean it's cheap. Particularly when you take into account just how cheap DVD production is, and how low break even point would theoretically be on something you have the rights for anyway.

On Amazon.co.jp, Simpsons Season 2 has a rrp ¥ 10,290, giving you 1 ep of 1990-1 US TV animation for ¥ 468. Compare that to the same year's Goldfish Warning DVD Box release, and you are paying ¥ 51,980 giving you 1 episode of 1991 Japanese TV animation for ¥ 963.

I'm not sure if the obviously smaller pressing run of Goldfish Warning really accounts for that difference in price. If it is, then there is something wrong at the root of the Japanese DVD industry.

Vampt Vo said...

Great review Clarissa, though I'm surprised that there was absolutely no mention of what Dave and Joel's entire GL episode was about: PHALLIC REFERENCES!

I just might have to go out and buy GL after listening to this. That's assuming of course that ADV doesn't go under before releasing it...

Wow Daryl, your Rambo rant at the end had me laughing like crazy.

Dan said...

Looks like the Wachowskis are fans of Utena, too. http://www.x-realms.net/2008/movies/new-speed-racer-film-still/
Link courtesy of Dark Horizons.

A.Nigger said...

Why were you expecting Nia-hate Craig? Just a question, nothing more.

A..Niger said...

Scratch that, just realized most people actually disliked Diebuster and Nia's appearance would remind them of Nono.

nckl said...

> Nia's appearance would remind them of Nono.

Nia's appearance didn't remind me of Nono, but her voice sure did. As it turns out, both are voiced by the same voice actress (Yukari Fukui)!

Oh, and I also went as saw Rambo because of Daryl's (and AnimeNation John's) recommendation to see it, and yeah, it was really f*cking awesome indeed.

zerochan said...

I might be wrong, but I always heard that part of the reason why JP packaged media (CDs, DVDs, etc) tends to be more expensive is because their distribution system is a goddamned mess. It's an archiac system that's got layers middle-men making ordering and getting things from manufacturer to store quite costly. (It's also why people suddenly stumble upon boxes and boxes of rare old games, books, and CDs when cleaning out JP distro warehouses - before computer tracking, it was stupidly easy to lose this stuff.)

Unfortunately, I have nothing to back me up on this beyond what I heard from a few people while living there :\

Behonkiss said...

Oh shits!

I know that talking about Roots Search more than once is blasphemy, but someone just put the whole thing online.

So go, everyone. Just be prepared to find something pleasant to do afterwards, so you can get yourself out of a funk after seeing something so unbelivably awful.

http://www.crunchyroll.com/media-272348/Roots-Search-OVA-Complete.html

Chris Sobieniak said...

quartears said...
Before listening to you guys and actually buying anime instead of downloading I was like most teenagers not placing any value on buying the DVD. After listening to you guys and getting DVDs I finally felt the power of the extra value. It feels weird to download shows now.


Still, it's the new paradigm! Either you're with it or left in the digital dust!

I would definitely watch anime on tv after school if they had it on. Even if it is just reruns of Zoids or whatnot. It would be totally awesome if Golgo 13 or Fist of the North Star was on.

Hell Hokuto no Ken would be the show I didn't want to miss if I was 12 again and cared about afternoon toonage as it had been.

But of course, it's been stated CN took it off due to the ratings being skewered to the very people they weren't targeting (like me). Face it, our time has passed! (giving me further reason for having dropped out of favor for TV, period, I get better traction online and from vids of what it had been)

Steve Harrison said...
I do wonder what Fox is going to do. They're not going to want to give up that Sat. block to local stations. I wonder if they're going to start in-house program creation again and flood it with 'reality' programming geared to 'tweens and teens.


Lord knows my local FOX affiliate is itchin' to do another local newscast to fill up those precious hours from being taken over by some kid's show or an infomercial. That's all it comes down to nowadays.

VZ said...

Aww man, where's part 2 to this show? I want of hear about Borgman and NYAF. Your audience is hungry.

Bohonkiss-Haha nice present for my birthday. I also just watched Dream Hunter Rem on there too.

VZ said...

Still no part 2?

Y'know, if you want your podcast to be popular you have to update often. Yes I know, real life and general laziness but still. Do you want that maid podcast to beat you?

Chris Sobieniak said...

I don't mind the laziness.

Regan Strongblood said...

Love the show guys ..but you are evil making us wait sooo long for part 2.

Daryl Surat said...

Still no part 2?

Y'know, if you want your podcast to be popular you have to update often.


If I wanted my podcast to be popular it would 1. be a video podcast, not an audio one, 2. not be about anime, and 3. not mention the things we talk about 75% of the time. This is not a popularity contest.

And while I'm at it, stop posting over and over about "when will Daryl review Kodomo no Jikan" or whatever, because that got old weeks ago. That also falls under RAMBO'S LAW, so keep your moe advocacy where it belongs: the CollectionDX forums.

My colossally-boring NYAF recap is edited. With any luck, it and the Borgman review will go up tonight.

Vampt Vo said...

I don't mind the laziness.

Yeah dude, calm down. As a matter of fact, if you look at the update schedule in the right way, they've still been (sort of) on a weekly schedule for the past few episodes, so you've got nothing to complain about.

Dan said...

Hey, Carl, I think you'd get a kick out of this. http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20080212/pl_afp/usvoteobamajapan

VZ said...

>And while I'm at it, stop posting over and over about "when will Daryl review Kodomo no Jikan" or whatever, because that got old weeks ago. That also falls under RAMBO'S LAW, so keep your moe advocacy where it belongs: the CollectionDX forums.<

No I wanted you to review that and Moetan cause I know you hate it and thus it'd be really really funny.

I'm sorry if I was sounding rude. You know I love your podcast. It's just many of us are having AWO withdrawl.

Oh and I watched Root's Search yesterday. Not the worst anime I've saw even with the WTF we end here now ending. It's from the 80's so it gets some pints from me. I also watched Dream Hunter Rem as well.

Regan Strongblood said...

A show idea I would love you guys to talk about would be your personal anime collections.Perhaps you could talk about the titles that are very hard to find or the ones you value the most that may be a interesting topic.As a rapid anime collector myself I would be interested in hearing about the anime you have collected over the years.

Anonymous said...

I've been waiting for your review of GL.

Thanks gang!

Kamina said...

In my time we had the 'watch-the-whole-series-before-making-a-comment' test, and we watched Dragon Ball and Gatchaman!, a friend of mine has de 'five minutes of the first episode test'... Gurren-Lagann is the greatest mixture of EPIC and WIN. I absolutely love it!, Gainax dropped out their 'New World Order is great' thoughts to support 'make anything you want as long your intentions are good and you put your soul in it'. Each sequence, each character, each name, everything, is full of symbolism, nothing is gratuitous in this masterpiece. It has everything, romance, action (a lot), great animation, enthralling storyline, and a strong message: be a man.